Friday, October 12, 2018

The Delphian School - The Not So Secretive Secular School in Sheridan, Or


Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About The Delphian School




Local Matters with Ken Moore

Ken: Hi welcome to the show. Today I have with me a man that I think many of you know and you'll be delighted to hear from him and if you don't know him you'll be curious to find out more about what he is about. It’s Mark Segal, he's the head.. assistant Headmaster at the Delphian School and he's with us today to give us a look into Delphian School and also the education system that you use there.

Mark: Right!

Ken:  So, Mark let’s start with a little history of the school.

Mark: Sure!

Ken: That's that incredibly interesting edifice out there on the side of the hill in Sheridan.

Mark: Sure, well it was a Jesuit novitiate and nonprofit, we formed the Delphian School 1974 and we opened the program in 1976. So, well over 40 years and yes I've been there for 44 years of it, going on 45.

Ken:  Well congratulations!

Mark: Thank you!

Ken: You’ve seen it change a lot. What are some things that come to mind about how it's changed?

Mark: Oh my gosh! The facility was quite old as you can imagine built in the twenties and then in the thirties, so a lot of remodeling. It wasn't... it's got great bones but it really wasn't built as a K through 12 facility so we've done a lot of remodeling: put in music rooms, classrooms, offices, narrowed the wide hall...  narrowed the wide halls to make more use of the building, put in a nice lower school. And, as I’m probably going to say continually, we invite people out for a tour, we love to have people out and I'll give them a free lunch because we want to let people know what we're doing.



Ken: Well I was on that that tour just was it last week and starting with the one of the high points, the lunch was incredible! (Laughs). The cafeteria is wonderful, the food there was so many choices, and it was all good. But, what I was impressed with… I want to say two things when I walked in the art that the students have done hanging on the walls was absolutely inspirational. I just felt like this this is… it’s just you're so lucky to have that in your living room cause...that’s another thing I got from that visit, it was a very intimate visit, a boarding school, that’s where people live and and work and learn and I really enjoyed that opportunity and you were so generous with your time and it is... people will call up they can schedule to come and do that.

Mark: Absolutely! We’re open for tours all the time, not just for enrollment, but to know for example employers want to know so that when they’re trying to woo people to the area, we’re one of the educational options for them, for community service. If nonprofits are looking for a place to have meetings, we have Larson Hall (named after our founding Headmaster) which we make available. And later this month, Oregon Department of Ed is going to be using our boardroom for the day for a meeting of an important task force so any reason people want to come out and find out more about our program, we welcome them.

Ken: I have a friend who was consider... is considering putting her son into Delphian School and she told her mother about that and her mother said: “Delphian School, whatl?!!” you know it was a very foreign idea to her. And so the grandmother, the mother..they went out to take a tour and by the time it was over, the grandmother was saying to her daughter it's not if you can do that with my grandchild, it's like how we how we going to do it?

Mark: Mm-hmm!

Ken: So it’s just that one visit was a miracle to them to see what you have there. Let me just ask about the connection with Scientology, Ron L. Hubbard.. tell us about that.

Mark: Sure, well it's simple: many of us got exposed to the study methods he developed.  Of course he founded the Church of Scientology, he's an author and a screenwriter and this was a separate sub study he undertook -  the field of study. When I got exposed to it, I said boy I wish I'd had this available. And when I got a chance to put it into a secular setting for children of all religions, because algebra is not a religious subject but if you could teach it so we could all master it; I love math, and I hate hearing that kids don't like algebra. And it's from some of the basic principles he distilled, which make so much common sense but we just don't teach students how to study, how to learn and so that's a simplicity, we use his study approach.

Ken: And I got a tour by one of your, I guess she’s going to be a junior next year.

Mark: Mm-hmm!

Ken: She was amazing. She was so knowledgeable and personable and I felt like I just got a great understanding what was going on there and I learned the three basic tenets of Ronald Hubbard’s education.

Mark: Sure, L. Ron Hubbard, one of the things he did is gave students some tools, and one is: don't go pass words you don't understand. We all buy our graduates dictionaries, but did they use them? and particularly there's definitions they might think they know a word and there might ba a definition that they don't know. Very common when you read about checks and balances... checks isn't the check off or to look it means to stop; like when you check your wheels when you're changing a tire. So, clearing that up and fully looking it up in a dictionary will really help a student to understand American system of government. And another one of course is don't step skip a step in your study; to master each step before going on and of course studying with the thing itself is very important and in some ways if we can get the real thing or a substitute so often when I was in the upper school, and I headed the upper school for many years, we’d take the students out and open up a car engine or go look at leaves or whatever they might be studying. We want them to study the real world, not just out of textbooks. And so these are tools we give students at various levels as they move through our program so that they can improve their studies. Because, after all, studying is not to pass a test, studying is to get information you can use that you can apply and that's our whole approach. That's what Mr. Hubbard gave to us and so we use it, as I said, with children of all races and religions. And it's interesting to see students all over the world for the first time realize I'm not trying to pass a test this is interesting, this is fun!  It’s fun to argue about Shakespeare or to do a science experiment and really understand what's going on in the world.

Ken: And you say international, I met kids from a lot of different countries, (Mark: oh yeah) a lot of different states. Tell us about how did that contribute?

Mark: Oh, well is part of our philosophy, really, to get as many different students into the population. Expose students to the culture that they're going to be living in you know. Thomas Friedman wrote the book “The World is Flat”, I think he's wrong I think it's hyper-connected, it’s some sort of geometric shape, because our students are going to be dealing internationally.  A student who just graduated wants help on his.. on letters of recommendation, so we're going to Skype and he's going to be in Asia somewhere and the fact we can do that these days and that we have so many trading partners, we just think it's vital in their education. Many alumni have told us that one of the things they liked was the fact they got to meet students from other countries and other cultures; makes you think about what you're doing. For example in Mexico they don't teach physical education, the students join soccer clubs, and it’s just oh, education can be different, culture can be different.  What do schools do and not do, what are the rules?  And it helps our students who understand American government, tell you that’s not how our government works or elections, things like that. But of course we do try to instill with them some American cultural values. I think that's why they come: is to understand democracy, freedom of speech, freed and open inquiry. Cause many don't enjoy that in all of their countries and I don't want to go too much into depth but I think you know what I'm talking about. Some some countries don't have the freedom of speech that we do and so we want them not to believe what we believe, we want them to form their own opinions, so we have a lot of debates. I’m sort of in charge of the Current Events Program and I bring a wide range of guest speakers and I start up a lot of lively discussion shall we say and of course halfway through I’ll switch sides and start arguing  for the other side, and often they’ll say I don’t know what Mark thinks, you know? Which is a really good sign I think.

Ken: As I was being led on the tour down into the the lower levels where there is a the art room,  the ceramics room, the woodworking room, the arts, the crafts, the the technology is so… you even have a 3D printer.

Mark: Oh sure, I think more than one!

Ken: So, it’s an amazing facility. But, during this tour, a young girl came up and looked up at me and said: “Questions?” and I didn't know what she was talking about. Can you explain what that might have been?

Mark: I wasn't there, but I think people want to answer any questions that you might have had.

Ken: Well, no, the person that gave me the tour said that she has a list of questions that she's supposed to ask people.  Is that a program?

Mark: Oh, during the Summer program, we teach English as a Second Language as part of our camp. We have students who come to us to learn English. And so part of what they get to do is have a little list of questions they can ask you:  Do you have a dog?  What’s your dog's name? What's your favorite color?  So, she must have been very early in the program and her first word would be  questions and if you said yes then she would read from this. Because we don’t want them to just learn it on paper. One of the weaknesses of teaching a second languages in other cultures is not having native speakers. So it's mostly reading and writing and of course you want to master the talking so that was the first step. I bet that she had little piece of paper and a pencil.

Ken: Yes she did.

Mark: And if you had said yes then they would have said: What’s your favorite candy?  What's your favorite fast-food? things like that.

Ken: So, English Second Language is a big part… a large part of your your curriculum there when people come from a foreign place.

Mark: Not during the school year. During the school year, because we are an English-language school, we offer a regular program but we will supplement it for students (International students). All students who come to us, let’s say the Upper School, the first thing we do is do a very rapidly some diagnostic work to find out where they are and because we're proficiency-based we'd want to fill in all the holes before they start our program proper and we call that an entry program and International students will get an international entry program helpful in their language and also culturally. Many for example do well at math but the symbols we use you might see some cultures make the 7 with a line through it and so they might not be familiar with the language we use to describe equations and so forth. So, the simple answer is that we are able with an integrated K through 12 curriculum to help students from around the world get a good English language based, very high level, high standard education.

Ken: And I got into the science room and I met the science teacher.

Mark: Oh, sure Marty Shaw.

Ken: Yeah, Marty

Mark: The crazy since guy.

Ken: Yeah, he was one… delightfully crazy. He said my job here is mostly to help kids get unstuck.

Mark: Yup!

Ken: And that was his description and all around the room was all kinds of… he got a laser pointer. He likes to point at things with his laser pointer, and he had some physics magic to show me and it was just intriguing and kids were involved in their project but coming up to ask questions. So let's get into it: Proficiency Learning:

Mark: Sure!

Ken: That’s a simple word but it's a big subject.

Mark: Sure! Well the two elements that I can distill for you about the program: one is, we want students to master and become proficient each step before going on. So, and the other one is project-based learning. So, on the proficiency side, what we mean by that is we're not studying to pass a test, we studying so you can apply the knowledge. Sal Kahn of the Kahn Academy just dis a video called Let’s Teach for Mastery Not Tests because even if you take a test and you get a 95% and go on if you test on Friday and go on on Monday that for 5% can come back and hurt you because when you later level, oops I didn’t master that. And also if somebody didn’t tell you what part you got wrong, you might have it backwards and thought that was correct. So, we use course… we don't teach by the lecture method, students study on their own. Now I must say, at this point, your listeners, your viewers, I hope they come and see what I'm talking about because I don't think I can describe it very well. But they have a course materials and a check sheet (a study guide) that they follow which balances the theory and the practical so they master each step. And what Marty might have seen in the lab is a student who’s read about some atoms but doesn't feel they fit together so he has atomic models or he'll work with clay or was Styrofoam and toothpicks so they: “Oh , that’s where the atoms match up, that’s a bond. And so we always want them to say:  If you don't get it, go down to the lab. He's also got the fabric book because they'll read The House on the Prairie about burlap or a material, and students don't know what they're talking about. What would be scratchy, what would be soft, what wouldn’t iron. So, they get to do that, they see coins, they see metals because how else are we going to learn about the world but as we come up with these questions get chances. So, his is more than a lab; it’s a resource center. And it's a lot of fun to go in there because he also wants to stimulate their thinking. And he’s got a great set of different projects, and he’s always got some sort of puzzling science thing. What do you think will happen? Oops it didn't do that. Why not? What’s really going on what's the science involved?

Ken: Well Bernie you and I met at the Chamber Commerce.

Mark: I’m Mark!

(Both Laugh)

Ken: There is a Bernie Siegel out there somewhere.

Mark: Yes

Ken: Mark, You and I met at “Chamber”, Chamber of Commerce and I got to know each other there and sometimes people come with you from Delphian School and I and I was talking to one of the people that came with you and I said what… what's a good tagline for The Delphian School because I was about to reveal my Delphian T-Shirt that I had borrowed, and she said: ”The only passing grade is 100%”.

Mark: That’s a truth

Ken: That’s just what you were talking about…

Mark: Yes

Ken: …with the proficiency learning.

Mark: Yeah, and the way it works is, literally, if a student misses anything on a on a quiz at the end, and again it's not to do any more than to help the student in sure they got it all. Cause we are all very willing to say: “Did I get it?” Have I got this right? You want to have somebody check it. Anything that they miss, they restudy and we do that very willingly. Students never study for tests in our place, because every course ends with a final practical activity to culminate everything they've done and they just want to go in to sort of validate that. Cause they don't want to go thinking they might have confused carbon and zinc or what other confusion they might have. So, really, very cooperatively, they get an examination and then the examiner person doing it will say oops you missed this, let’s talk a little bit more. Ok, let’s have you restudy those parts and make sure you’ve got it. And it’s a smiling face activity. I should say that we keep track of this and well over 50% of the students get a hundred percent on the examination because it's very practically oriented: “here, can you do this?” On multiple choice questions, which we don't ever give, you could guess! It's the worst kind of testing cause you test the easy stuff, not the stuff you need. And in fact I hate to say it but when you go take a driver's test guess what you take the theory and then they put you behind the wheel, and all of our tests have a “behind  the wheel” component. “Can you apply it? Show me!” And, If you miss, we’ll just restudy. The examiner doesn't say “you'll never drive” but he says here's you did know how to do a left turn or parallel parking; go work on that! Cause we all want to have safe drivers. What drives me crazy, is that we give everyone a , cause we don’t know what they don’t know.  I want my doctors to know every disease,  you know? and so my real pitch please if we could do one thing to change education take Student Competition out against each other let's have them compete against ignorance and that's how I like to see our whole system shifted over. Again, and in proficiency, everybody can master the material. Don’t you want everybody to hammer well, to plumb well, to to be a good electrician? Why would we ask for anything less?

Ken: Look, Mark, it sounds great! I particularly like that part about not studying for tests, but the river is going to meet the road when you go take the SAT, right? Or wouldn’t you…?

Mark: You knew you were going to get me started, didn’t you?

Ken: So, how do your students come up against SATs or ACTs or these tests with multiple choices?

Mark: Ok, I’ll calm down.

Ken: No! It’s.

Mark: Sure. I get worked up. I personally think that students spend too much time preparing for the SAT and ACT. I don’t like them at all. I think that they are flawed beyond recognition. At fairtest.org you can find over a thousand colleges that don't want to see SAT or ACT tests. The University of Chicago just announced: they are not going to look at it anymore. So we're getting a big crack in that egg. Then there's been rumors of lots of other colleges wanting to get rid of it.

Ken: Well that's a relief because that SAT score just follows you around; it's almost like it'll be on your tombstone, it's, it's just like it's you! And taking that off and getting more to proficiency learning, which I think more and more of the country is starting to acknowledge.

Mark: Absolutely! Absolutely! And just on SAT and ACT, we do take students to take it,  they can study it on their own. But, it’s just sort of my personal opinion and I make it pretty well known because, on that, I much rather have students work for Habitat for Humanity over the summer than rather some students who spend the whole summer studying the SAT and I think if they said that to the college: “Listen I worked for Habitat for Humanity all summer, instead of studying the SAT, because that’s not knowledge, that’s not useful! But I recognize some people do it and I try to help em out to reduce that anxiety about it. But you're going to ask me another question.

Ken: Well I just wanted you to.. you coined the phrase probably.. “Sage” how does it go?

Mark: Oh, the Sage.. Yes, one of the changes we're not the only school doing proficiency, we were just we think the first because I haven’t found anyone else and because we have so many visitors from other schools that want to see how we do when we're doing, but this shift generally in proficiency, competency, mastery, whatever you want to call it, is “moving the teacher from the sage on the stage to the guide on the side”. Which we've been doing, we've never had lectures. We just don't believe in them because it believes that every student is grasping each and every thing you are saying is teachable moments.

Ken: Ah, all together is probably…  

Mark: It’s probably not true of McMinville but, or elsewhere in the country, I know students who get hungry, who get emotional, who have their feelings hurt, girlfriend, boyfriend whatever; they're worried about the big game, the drama part. And they're not all present and some are physically absent. So why we lecture and move on instead of devising a system where each student can move and master his own pace?  It was not uncommon for me to rejoice in the following: the student would say “Mark yesterday I studied a section of my course, can I go back and restudy it? I don't think I got it all” Yes, it's for you!  That makes me so happy because if you were working on something on your house out of a book and you say “I don’t quite know how to do this yet”, you would say I’m going to look it over again in the morning. “What am I not getting here?” before you go cutting or scraping or hammering right?

Ken: Well Mark you are so generous with you time, you spoke to our rotary Sunrise Rotary Club this morning and you said something there that I want you to reiterate about a constant, “Time is a consdtant”. How did that go?

Mark: Sure! In the proficiency movement we say: well I’m old, I'm older than you, I hope. But when we went to school, it was a 50-minute class, hundred eighty days, and time was the constant and learning varied. I remember students in my classes who just weren’t getting it at all in my high school back in the 60s. So, what we've said from day one, we're turning that around, we want learning to be the constant and time is the variable. And I found at schools of using proficiency all around the country: from Chugach Alaska to the Adams Westminster School District in Colorado to Lindsay California, these schools have turned things around because the student’s what’s important, and if the student is important, their mastery is important! So, the simplicity is: “old school, time was the constant, new school learning is the constant. And that's what we've been about since day one. And not just learning in the classroom, but learning about life. You know?

Ken: So, I can break that down a little bit. So,  learning isn't going to happen on a time schedule it's how you learn kind of irrelevant to how long it takes?

Mark: That’s right!

Ken: And if people are focused and motivated they're going to get it.

Mark: Yep

Ken: But you’ve got to make sure they got it before...

Mark: That’s right!

Ken: …before time moves you into something else.

Mark: And what’s interesting, if, if your viewers go to YourMD at OHSU you'll find that the Oregon Health and Science University has switched over to a competency-based program. And in an interview I read, I think it was the dean, just a few days ago, said that we might have a student who’s served as a medic in Afghanistan and doesn't need some of these anatomy classes, they've got the real world experience! Other ones who come from more theoretical backgrounds may need more, so they're customizing each student’s program. One thing that touched me was I got the idea that the faster you can get a student out with competency into the medical world, less debt, more they can go to serve underserved populations. How exciting is that?!  But it’s emerging in our system of higher Ed: Linda Shaw the president Southern Oregon University was recently did a webinar with knowledge works at proficiency-based National Group and they were talking about switching to what they call “competency-based education”. The same thing warning the colleges that don't switch over… people aren't going to sit through 4 years of a lecture 3 days a week stretching it out. They want more rapidly paced information they can use.

Ken: To reiterate what they said, if they can reach competency in a shorter amount of time, then it's costing less, they have less student debt, they don't have to they can go maybe contribute to the world in the way that they don't have to tie themselves into a path that demands they have a certain amount of money to pay off this student debt. So they have more choice to do to do to community, jobs that do well for the community.

Mark: Endless possibilities, I don't think the school dictates that. But it frees up the resources of the teaching faculty to give those that need the help. Because we want them all to be proficient and maybe they can get since we have a critical shortage of medical, right? Maybe they can get more students through, if they're not all doing for years. One thing you're going to have to ask yourself is why do we call it a 4-year college degree? Where did it decree that part of the right of passage is 4 years of institution, because we don't do that in Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, Cub Scouts, we don't do that in music. You master a piece and move on. If you're going to learn a martial art, your master it and move on. They don't say you got a one-year belt or some… Right?  

Ken: Yeah

Mark: It’s a belt that determines mastery.

Ken: Those are great analogies!

Mark:I’m wound up!

Ken: Yeah, merit badges, boom boom, some kids just grab and go and it doesn't it doesn't have to take a certain amount of time as how much they can how they can how fast they can become proficient.

Mark: Right! And they love it, to know that in a subject that’s difficult for them, they can slow down, get help, take their time. And if they're getting it, they can zoom along and nothing's better than watching a student who’s zooming along, smiling and getting it. Recently we had guests that said: “Mark, we’ve seen hard working students and we’ve seen happy students; we've never seen it in the same student!” You know?

(Both Laugh)

Ken: Now, tell people a little bit about some of the boards that you serve on.

Mark: Sure!

Ken: How do they contribute to the education field. You're not just sitting out there and Sheridan…

Mark: No!

Ken: …out behind your desk waiting for kids to come ask you questions. You are all over the country. Tell us about it.

Mark: Ah yea. Well, I head up the Oregon Federation of Independent Schools and I've actually been doing that since 1988-89 and I represent Oregon in legislature in the teacher’s standards and practices. Work… we have a great relationship with the Department of Education we now have a working private education committee. Since 1994, I've been on the board of the Council of American private education for 12 years representing the very State organizations like mine and then just cause I'm sort of keeping at it, they made me a “member-at-large” so that that is the that is the national Private School Organization that has the Catholics, the Episcopal Schools, the Lutheran Schools, Seventh-day Adventist Schools, Montessori and Waldorf - all those schools. And we meet in Washington DC. So that takes me to Congress, the White House to the Department of Ed. Last year I was the only private school leader on the panel on the new “Every Student Succeeds Act” which has a private school ombudsman, so I do that. Then, if I flip another switch, because I'm a proficiency advocate, I go around the country speaking to private school groups primarily, about... I want them to switch to competency as fast as they can because it's not a public-private problem it's an old operating system, we got “rotary phone schools” in a “smartphone world”. And so, next Monday through Thursday I'll be attending the Seventh-day Adventist educators. Every six years I have a conference. This year is in Chicago, and I'm doing three major presentations there on switching to proficiency and then I'll be offering workshops, meeting with educators. Marty arranged that; including the nearby University. They want to talk about switching their teachers Ed program. It’s really a hot item, because all around the country schools, and school districts and whole states are switching to proficiency or competency. It's rapidly growing and so I just get excited about it because that means more students that are well-educated were engaged and that's slips away from the bad behavior thing when students are engaged. Right?

Ken: Mmm

Mark: When when they're coming to class and having fun why are they going to have fights or do the crazy stuff?

Ken: Tell us about how you’ve… are interfacing with our local public schools.

Mark: Oh! It's interesting. I've met with Mary Alice regularly over the years and we have good arguments and discussions and try to help out. I chair the the the Chamber of Commerce's Business Ed Partnership Committee. In the West Valley I formed up a group with with their meaning. We meet with… it’s Sheridan to school district, Willamina School District, Confederated Tribes of Grand Ronde, Head Start, librarians, local leaders; and we meet every month if there's enough of us want to meet, we rotate the meetings between Sheridan, the Tribe and The Delphian School. And we have great discussions about what we can do to improve education. We have a lot of tutoring going on, particularly in Willamina. And we work with smart… our students go down and “Start  Making a Reader Today” program and do pull out tutoring; all kinds of work we've had, particularly down in  Willamina that just has worked out well for us. And then, I chair the McMinnville Leadership, McMinville Leadership committee that came out of my Chamber chairmanship in 2007. So, we are doing a lot!

Ken: That is a lot of reach! We just got about a minute left. You brought some pictures. Why don’t we just flip through those?

Mark: Sure!

Ken: Carolyn, can you pull those up? All right, there’s the nice…

Mark: Main building!

Ken: Yep.

Mark: Probably pictures of kids.

Ken: What’s next Carolyn? There you go

Mark: We have a great lower school, we cater to the local population.

Ken: Mostly kids of instructors.

Mark: Yeah, it’s a mix, it’s a mix

Ken: And from local kids.

Mark: Oh Absolutely! We have a bus that comes from McMinnville takes kids in in the morning and their parents pick them up at various times in the afternoon.

Ken: Alright Carol, just go ahead and go through these.

Mark: Sure if you could just look at these we have a totally rehabilitated Gym, that’s the second floor running track.

Ken: There’s the Delphian Dragon.

Mark: Absolutely! and you Ken, I want to make sure…

Ken: Climbing wall.

Mark: …the viewers know that they’re welcome to come for

Ken: Yeah

Mark: …a free tour and a free lunch any time, because I don't think my words have quite captured all that the Delphian School spirit is about.

Ken: And they’ve got to go into the chapel and the reaction is often the same probably: “Hey this looks like Hogwarts”.

(laughs) 

Mark: very, very common.

Ken: It’s very cool!

Mark: very common.

Ken: Thanks so much for being here Mark!

Mark: Oh my pleasure

Ken: It’s been a great tour. And, again, call up The Delphian School and get a tour!

Mark: Absolutely! Please do!






Monday, October 1, 2018

The Delphian School - Proficiency Based Education


Proficiency Based Education




Credit for the video: AdmissionsQuest

We are joined today by Mark Siegel assistant Headmaster at the Delphian School in Sheridan Oregon and he's talking today with us about proficiency-based education.

Mark: Good morning!

Thank you for joining us today Mark! You spend a lot of time thinking, teaching, and blogging about proficiency-based education. When you talk about proficiency-based education, what exactly are we talking about and how does it differ from what we're used to or have come to expect?

Mark: Sure, well, the context is that in Oregon, for example, only two thirds of our high school students are graduating. And Governor Kitzhaber says that only 25% of them are really ready for college. So we've got to do something better. The fundamental thing is that the current system has been based on time being the constant, 180 days 50 minutes for algebra and then in 180 days you're supposed to get it. But with time being the constant, learning becomes a variable. Some get it and some don't. Proficiency means learning is the constant and with learning the constant then time has to be a variable but when we can do that and we have to move from mastery, from proficiency to proficiency, taking as much time as they need, that is the model that is a much better model and that's proficiency based education.

Ok, so I've got this picture of C Time from my perspective which is having gone through C Time education years ago, what does it mean in practice in the classroom? You talked about you know “when the students master it, then they move on”. So, what’s different in the classroom and what do teachers have to do differently in that setting then?

Mark: Well, I'll give you a little example: Sal Khan of the Khan Academy (a very popular education site) has a set of short videos and classrooms are flipping so that the students watch the videos at home and in class they do the homework where they get the mastery and so then the teacher can spend enough time with each of them and at home they can watch the video over and over again until they get it. So, that’s a proficiency model where you spend as much time as you need at each step and teachers have implemented this in a wide range of context. Here at the school we’ve been doing it for 35 years but we don't have grades are grade levels. But I've seen it implemented in traditional classroom settings but the main thing is that the students aren't walked into what we call “the tyranny of a lecture” where they're having to sit and listen where they may not be ready for it so if it's tape recorded lectures or they are following a study guide or the teacher is putting them in a project based approach, but, I could go on and on about it. It’s just very different, but it's much, much better.

Ok, which brings me to my next question: So, if we are talking about moving away from “the tyranny of the lecture”, how do students experience and work through learning and material differently then?

Mark: Well, in the short amount of time I have, let me tell you 2 things: 1 they love it, in public school settings we get a lot of reports that the students in a proficiency-based class then push their other teachers to adopt that method. The fact is, and Sal Khan recently talked about this again, students who are even doing well, know there are earlier gaps in their education. And in a proficiency system you can be honest about it, and if you are in algebra, and you are having trouble with fractions, you can say: “look, I need to stop out and work on my fractions” and that honesty is a big relief for even the quote “A students” who know that they might have passed tests that there is gaps in their knowledge that is going to catch up with them somewhere. So, 1 it’s a relief, secondly in a grading system when quote “only a few kids get it all” with the approaches they are all going to get to learn it. It might take some of them longer at some points, some can go quickly when they master it, but the idea where the teachers are saying instead of a game in which only some of you get it, let’s play a game in which all of you can get everything that we can possible deliver to you, so we can fulfill our promise. And students really, really like that. They respond just in a fantastic way. It takes out arbitraries of grading, it takes out all the nuttiness.

Ok, mm, so, here is one question I have though, about it. How does?.. Who keeps the pace? Does the student set the pace or is the teacher become sort of the “motivator coach”? In proficiency based education, who keeps the pace? You know, say you are moving along and you got it, but you’d like to take a break for a while (if you are a student)?

Mark: Sure, well, the answer is that the student actually begins owning their own education - setting their own pace. Because for the first time, there is that relief: “I’m not going pass what I don’t know”. And because, one of the other elements is they know what they are going to be ending up using it for, they are going to end up knowing where they are going with it. So, we find students much more eager. Public school teachers report that students are coming in before class saying Ï know I need this, can you give me some extra help?” because they see how it’s foundational.  Sal Khan talks about our current system as one… like a “Swiss Cheese education”; it’s full of holes! And when students want to.. they come to school everyday with a bunch of expectations. And when they can get what they’ve come to a class for, they’ll proceed very quickly, they will really like it. So, in our system, sometimes students don’t take breaks, they come in early, they can study late, because they’re loving it. And that’s a nice rapport you get with students eager to come to the classroom because they are going to be able to succeed everyday.

Right, and that’s… that from an old teacher’s perspective is a great thing!

Mark: Absolutely!

You used the word “system” which brings me to my next question, what role does proficiency based education have in sort of larger systemic education reforms? You know, it… I can see how it translates really easily into a small setting, into a classroom, into a place like Delphian. What role does it have say nationwide or statewide?

Mark: Well, while we are a leader in the private school field of proficiency, I must tell you that the public schools are really catching on. Starting with Alaska school districts, here in Oregon we’ve been doing proficiency based on smaller scales in public schools since 2002. And just recently, in September, when the governor of Oregon, Governor Kitzhaber, gave his back to school speech, he said that it’s his number 1 priority putting in flexibility and proficiency in all of our classrooms. He talked about taking the time it takes for each student to get it whether they are ahead or behind the rest of the students. The State Board of Education for years now has adopted proficiency based standards. And students, in Oregon, can get credit for proficiency. You can get credit on your transcript for a year of French if you can pass the final test, whether you’ve had to sit through the class or not. And in Colorado, and in states across the country, this is catching on. Sal Khan, with his work in the Kahn Academy is working with school districts in the Bay Area. So, it’s a perfect fit.

Ok, ok. As we sort of come to a close here, a Delphian-specific question: What does a Delphian School student who’s completed the proficiency based curriculum take with them to college and into life beyond that’s very different or differs from the skills they learn through the traditional lecture in C Time experience?

Mark: A great question. And I think there is a couple of ways to look at it: One, we have alumni who stay in touch with us all the time, and so we get a lot of feedback from how they are doing in college, for example. And it’s typical that they find out that they are one of the few students in the class that can actually write. And teachers will make them their assistants or point out and use their papers as examples of good writing. Because the students left here with a set of proficiencies and abilities, they did so many projects, they did so many practical activities, they applied their knowledge. So, when they leave here (Delphian School), even if they are stuck in a traditional lecture class, because they know how to study, they have been on their own as independent learners for so long that they do very well. They can get pass the flaws in the system and make sure they are getting a good education for themselves. Another thing that I love to point out is that now our alumni are enrolling their children in school. And if that doesn’t tell you something when they have decided wherever they are living in the country and so forth to have their kids come back and to our school and some of them even move back to the area to make that education possible for them. I think that’s pretty telling, and of course we get reports from how well they are doing in life no matter what they do. They all continue to tell us, “I’m so glad I did this course of study or that course of study or I did that project because this is how I’ve been applying it in my job and in my life”. So, a continuous set of feedback. I’m reminded of how Sal Kahn talks about: “Imagine that you are learning to juggle three balls and then at the end of a week you get a C on it and then they say we are on to knives”. Well that’s a pretty scary thought! (Laughs) And our students don’t ever feel that way. They feel that by the time they’ve graduated, they’ve left with everything that they came to get and they can apply in their lives.

All right well Mark, thank you so much for talking with us today!

Mark: My pleasure!